Note from Ville Hietanen (Jerome) of and Currently, I (but not my brother of the “prophecyfilm12” mail) have updated many of my old believes to be more in line with Vatican II and I no longer adhere to the position that Vatican II or the Protestants, Muslims, Buddhists or various Traditionalists Groups and Peoples etc. or the various teachings, Saints and adherents to Vatican II (and other canonized by Vatican II) such as Saint Mother Theresa or Saint Pope John Paul II etc. was heretical or damned or not Catholic (or not the Pope) – or that they are unworthy of this title. I have also embraced the sexual views on marriage of Vatican II, and I no longer adhere to the strict interpretations as expressed on this website and on my other websites. To read more of my views, see these articles: Some corrections: Why I no longer condemn others or judge them as evil I did before. Why I no Longer Reject Vatican II and the Traditional Catholic Priests or Receiving Sacraments from Them (On Baptism of Desire, Baptism of Blood, Natural Family Planning, Una Cum etc.) Q&A: Damnation and Eternal Torments for Our Children and Beloved Ones is "True" and "Good" but Salvation for Everyone is "Evil" and a "Heresy"?

Joyce Meyer - Biography

Joyce Meyer is a Charismatic "Christian" woman preacher. Known for her "no nonsense" and "tell it like it is" style. Meyer and her husband Dave have four grown children, and live outside St. Louis, Missouri. Her so called ministry is headquartered in the St. Louis suburb of Fenton, Missouri.

Joyce Meyer - False Preacher, False Teacher and Heretic

Meyer teaches that Jesus went to Hell to pay for our sins

"What Should You Believe?" is the title to chapter 4 (page 35) and the chapter I will focus on. Since the book's title implies that its purpose is to help someone to make "The Most Important Decision You Will Ever Make," we can assume that this chapter will discuss the facts whereby they may make an intelligent decision.

Joyce writes, "During that time He entered hell, where you and I deserved to go (legally) because of our sin. He paid the price there. ... no plan was too extreme. ... Jesus paid on the cross and in hell." (Underlining in the original) On page 36, she continues, "God rose up from His throne and said to demon powers tormenting the sinless Son of God, 'Let Him go.' Then the resurrection power of Almighty God went through hell and filled Jesus. ... He was resurrected from the dead - the first born-again man." (Underlining in the original.)

Meyer teaches that Jesus went to Hell to be tormented by demons to pay for our sins. This is outrageously heretical. Jesus died once and for all on the cross for our sins, he did not descend to Hell to be tormented by demons to again offer up payment of our sins.

"There is no choice of anyone going to heaven unless they believe this truth I am presenting. You cannot go to heaven unless you believe with all your heart that Jesus took your place in hell." (Underlining added.)

So if we don't believe in a (heretical) layman's private opinion, we are going to be damned? Jesus indeed went to Hell, or rather, the Limbo of the Fathers, but not to pay the price of our sins once again, but to redeem the elect of the Old Testament Law.

1 Peter 3:18-20, "Because Christ also died once for our sins, the just for the unjust: that he might offer us to God, being put to death indeed in the flesh, but enlivened in the spirit. In which also coming he preached to those spirits that were in prison: Which had been some time incredulous, when they waited for the patience of God in the days of Noe, when the ark was a building: wherein a few, that is, eight souls, were saved by water."

Jesus didn't ascend into Heaven until after His Resurrection, as John 20:17 proves. The Apostles' Creed correctly states that Jesus was crucified, died and was buried; He descended into Hell; on the third day He rose again from the dead and then ascended into Heaven. He didn't ascend to Heaven until after His Resurrection, and He descended into Hell on the day of His death. What was this Hell? It was Abraham's bosom, the waiting place of the just of the Old Testament.

As Haydock Bible Commentary puts it:

"Ver. 19. In which (to wit, soul or spirit) also he came, and preached to those spirits who were in prison. The true and common interpretation of this place seems to be, that the soul of Christ, after the separation from the body and before the resurrection, descended to a place in the interior parts of the earth, called hell in that which we call the apostles' creed, (sometimes called Abraham's bosom, sometimes Limbus Patrum [Limbo of the Fathers], a place where were detained all the souls of the patriarchs, prophets, and just men, as it were in prison) and preached to these spirits in this prison; i.e. brought them this happy news, that he who was their Redeemer was now come to be their deliverer, and that at his glorious ascension they should enter with him into heaven, where none could enter before our Redeemer, who opened as it were heaven's gates.

Prison. See here a proof of a third place, or middle state of souls: for these spirits in prison, to whom Christ went to preach after his death, were not in heaven, nor yet in the hell of the damned; because heaven is no prison, and Christ did not go to preach to the damned. (Challoner)

St. Augustine, in his 99th epistle, confesses that this text is replete with difficulties. This he declares is clear, beyond all doubt, that Jesus Christ descended in soul after his death into the regions below, and concludes with these words: Quis ergo nisi infidelis negaverit fuisse apud inferos Christum? In this prison souls would not be detained unless they were indebted to divine justice, nor would salvation be preached to them unless they were in a state that was capable of receiving salvation."

Meyer heretically teaches that Jesus lost His Divinity

Paul not only warned the Corinthian church of accepting "another gospel," he warned them of accepting "another Jesus." (2 Corinthians 11:4) On page 38, Joyce writes,

"For three days He was alone paying for our sins as "only a man." (underlining in the original)

On page 37, she writes,

"As God's Spirit left Him."

Here again she regurgitates the teachings of other heretics before her. It's all part of the myth of Jesus losing His Deity on the cross, going to Hell as a mere man, being reborn in Hell, receiving back His Deity and thus becoming God once again.

It is heresy to say that at some point in time, God ceased being Triune in nature. When the nature of Jesus is changed, "another Jesus" is produced. This is the gospel of Antichrist, the Dividing of Jesus:

1 John 4:2-3, "Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh, is of God: And every spirit that dissolveth Jesus is not of God: and this is Antichrist, of whom you have heard that he cometh..."

Both definitions of Antichrist deal with a denial of the truth about who Jesus Christ is. The truth about Our Lord Jesus Christ and the truth about the Most Holy Trinity are the very foundations of the Christian religion. They are the most important truths in the universe.

This is why the early councils of the Church condemned with the utmost vigor even the slightest deviation from the truth about Jesus Christ or the Trinity. And this is why the greatest enemies of Jesus Christ in history were not those men who caused Christ's followers temporal harm, but those who were most effective and blasphemous in attacking the truth about Jesus Christ – which is the very foundation of one's eternal salvation.

One of the first and most notorious men in Church history to pervert the doctrine of the Incarnation was the 5th century heretic Nestorius, who was condemned by the Council of Ephesus in 431. The case of the heretic Nestorius is very important in identifying the gospel of Antichrist.

Nestorius was the heretic who tried to dissolve Jesus (1 John 4:2-3), and he did so by perverting the truth of the Incarnation. And by dissolving or dividing Our Lord Jesus Christ into two persons, Nestorius's Antichrist doctrine logically resulted in the worship of two Christs, and introduced, as a consequence, THE WORSHIP OF MAN!

Pope Vigilius, Second Council of Constantinople, 553: "The holy synod of Ephesus… has pronounced sentence against the heresy of Nestorius… and all those who might later… adopt the same opinions as he held… They express these falsehoods against the true dogmas of the Church, OFFERING WORSHIP TO TWO SONS, trying to divide that which cannot be divided, AND INTRODUCING TO BOTH HEAVEN AND EARTH THE OFFENCE OF THE WORSHIP OF MAN. But the sacred band of heavenly spirits worship along with us only one Lord Jesus Christ."

I was notified by a personal testimony that Joyce was corrected by a "pastor" about this book in which this Antichrist heresy was written, before he would allow her to speak at his church and as a result, made some changes in her book. The "Second Printing - May, 1993" edition was definitely revised but found that no mention is made of the fact. (Up to this point, I have been quoting from the "First Printing - August, 1991" edition.) The only chapter that appears to have been changed is chapter four. Some of the Born-Again Jesus Gospel was altered or deleted but the bulk of it remained.

Assuming Mrs. Meyer believes that error has been deleted and that the book is now clean, this prompts me to ask: Why hasn't she warned anyone to trash the old book? Why hasn't she recalled the original edition? Why hasn't she made a note in the new edition of her errors in the previous edition? Why has she opted to let the changes go by quietly unnoticed? Why hasn't she publicly recant her heresy when she had publicly taught heresy?

Or were the changes simply insignificant? Not really worth mentioning? In reality, the changes were very significant. She deleted the following bold faced words from the second printing,

"As God's Spirit left Him." (page 37)

"...this truth I am presenting." (page 37)

"Jesus took your place in hell." (page 37)

"...the Father filled His spirit again. For three days He was alone paying for our sins as "only a man." The price had to be paid by someone just like us." (page 38, underlining in the original)

"He went to hell to pay the debt you owed," (page 4 1)

These deleted portions are indeed significant. But perhaps they are merely minor issues in Joyce's mind. If that's her thinking, I must ask, is "another gospel" which sends the lost to Hell insignificant?

However, even though Meyer's did delete some passages, she is still teaching in the book that Jesus was in Hell "only a man."

In all, her book is still poisoned with heresy. If she had a grip on the Gospel (as the title of the book declares), she would have publicly repented of all the error and heresy published in the first printing, renounced the Jesus only a man doctrine, and denounced those who still teach it.

Some would argue that it's no big deal. Let's check to see what the word of God has to say.

"I wonder that you are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ, unto another gospel. Which is not another, only there are some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ. But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach a gospel to you besides that which we have preached to you, let him be anathema [condemned]. As we said before, so now I say again: If any one preach to you a gospel, besides that which you have received, let him be anathema [condemned]." Galatians 1:6-9

Meyer says she's not a sinner

Her now-unavailable taped message, "What Happened from the Cross to The Throne?" Meyer continued to teach the "Born-Again Jesus" doctrine. In this message, Meyer claims to have received the Baptism of the Spirit and sometime afterward felt a strange "flipping and turning" insider her body (stomach). She claimed that this experience led to a greater understanding of salvation and a greater revelation of Jesus' "spirit death" in hell. Meyer, like many others in the Charismatic movement, believes that Jesus suffered in hell under the power of demons.

Joyce Meyer also claimed that she no longer sins in the same taped message:

"I'm going to tell you something folks, I didn't stop sinning until I finally got it through my thick head I wasn't a sinner anymore. And the religious world thinks that's heresy and they want to hang you for it. But the Bible says that I'm righteous and I can't be righteous and be a sinner at the same time… All I was ever taught to say was, 'I'm a poor, miserable sinner.' I am not poor, I am not miserable and I am not a sinner. That is a lie from the pit of hell. That is what I was and if I still am then Jesus died in vain. Amen?"

However, the bible is clear, "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us" (1 John 1:8). However, Meyer says that this teaching is a lie from the pit of Hell and that if it was true, Jesus died in vain.

In her statement, Meyer rightly believed that she was a sinner and sinned before. But now, because she thinks she's not a sinner, she doesn't sin anymore. According to that logic, taken to it's only logical conclusion, murder is not murder if I believe or think that I didn't commit murder.

When we commit real sins, which all of us do, then we are sinners, plain and simple. We are not righteous because we declare ourselves as righteous, as Meyer do. But we are righteous because we are made righteous by a Holy God -- provided we do what we can to stay out of mortal and venial sin.

Is Joyce Meyer an "ordained" minister?

On her website, Meyer's states:

"Is Joyce Meyer an ordained minister? Joyce was ordained over 25 years ago. She has a worldwide congregation through the Enjoying Everyday Life television and radio programs. Joyce speaks regularly at public conferences in the United States and around the world. She also preaches occasionally at the St. Louis Dream Center church, an inner-city outreach of Joyce Meyer Ministries."

However, the Bible teaches that women may not function in a teaching, authority role over men (1 Tim. 2:12ff; 1 Cor. 14:34-35). The role of a public woman spiritual teacher, "pastor", "priest", "minister" etc. over man is not the place of woman. In addition, the Church also teaches that the ordination of women into the priesthood - even if the rite of ordination is the valid rite of ordination - would be invalid (and that is without even considering the fact that none of the thousands upon thousands of protestant sects today even have a valid rite of ordination to begin with, which means that none of the millions of "ordained" protestant ministers today are neither priests nor ordained and they are all just ordinary laymen like you and me!). All of this, of course, further demonstrates, in addition with the other information covered, that Meyer's is neither ordained, biblical nor Christian.

What the Bible Really Teaches

If you are tired of being deceived by false teachers, preachers and heretics like Joyce Mayer and her bulk, please consult the following articles and information that are presented with the true and biblical, Christian teaching.

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